New 75 gallon reef

[topQuark]

As I mentioned in another post, my wife and I decided that the 55 gallon aquarium would be too small for us, so we're going with a 75 gallon. There is enough room for a 20-30 gallon sump (I intend to use a glass aquarium for the sump). I'm thinking of cycling the tank volume roughly 20 times an hour, and I wanted some feedback about equiptment choices...

Overflow: CPR CS-102 (flow rate of 1400 gph)
Sump Pump: Iwaki MD-70 (flow rate of 1500 gph with a max head of 31.8")
Skimmer: Aqua-C EV-180 (which pump should I get for this thing?)

[tendar]

I prefer to have a lowerflow in my sump in the 5 times turn over and not over 10 times since the more flow giong through the sump the louder it is and bubble to battle. I prefer to have the majority of my water flow through closed loops.
The Iwaki pump is nice but pretty strong for a 75 gall return pump. That would be a lot of low going through a sump of the size your talking with lots of bubble problems unless you get 3-4 baffles in the sump and may still be a slight issue. The 20+ turnover rate is good I just personally thing that much through a 20-30 gall sump may be more problems than you want. If you have not bought the tank yet you should consider a predrilled tank with built in overflows. Over all it will much easier to work with and less chances of floods and the price will probably be about the same as getting one with out overflows and getting the cpr overflow box.
Also for the overflow box I would consider the Lifereef or amicrile overflows as they less likly to lose syphon and flood.
I just recently got a AquaC EV180 and am very pleased with it. I got the mag7 that is recomended and it does a good job. It took about a week for it to really get going though so give it some time to breakin.

[topQuark]

What kind of flow rate do you get from a pre-drilled tank???

We haven't bought anything yet!!!

I was looking at All-Glass aquariums, and the tank with the built in overflow only has a single overflow in the corner... I'm not sure what kind of flow rate you get with this, but I am pretty sure that I would want at least 10 times flow, so I need 750 gph, minimum.

What's the deal with the bubbles??? Why is that so bad?

[brody98]

A 75 corner overflow will do right around 800 gph with 1" holes if I remember correctly maybe more but man your talking a lot of noise, I'm running 650 through mine(75 oceanic corner over flow w/18g sump)and it drove me nuts until I made a (Durso like) stand pipe. The bubbles are bad in the situation your thinking of because the more you flow the more pressure coming down the overflow hose into the sump(kinda like spraying a garden hose into a bucket) this creates bubbles... anytime you slosh water around violently it creates bubbles but with salt water those bubbles don’t "pop" right away and if your sump isn’t set up correctly they will get sucked into the return pump and wind up in your tank looking back at you, and after awhile it looks like a snow storm in there. I have 650gph on my return pump and 4 power heads at 100gph on a wave machine it seems to do well. My sump is set up with a divider so it is in a U shape with one baffle that stops all of my bubbles from getting to the pump. hope this helps a little ...just my 2 cents

[topQuark]

Just an update... My wife and I just purchased a 75 gallon Oceanic reef-ready tank (we decided that the overflow box is too risky). The tank is not set up yet (my dad and I are still building the stand) and we're still thinking about pumps, as well as lighting. I was thinking about going with one of the Iwaki pumps, and a ton of power compact lighting.

Just curious... what are people's power bills like with metal halide lighting? Say, two 175k on 8 hours a day, versus two 250k on 8 hours a day.

[Chuck S]

Well you say a ton of PC's

Electrical consumption is based on wattage. If you going to say have 720watts(2-250 halides plus 2 110 watt VHO actinics) versus say 594 watts of PC there is not much of a electric difference. It costs me about 120 bucks in the winter to run the tanks. Now keep in mind I have 5 reef tanks. I would estimate you would spend about 50 bucks a month on everything to run that tank. In the summer I can add another 100 onto that figure for chiller/AC total between all tanks.

But 40-50 a month is a good all around estimate of what it will cost to run the tank

[brody98]

My bill was 78 bucks last month(total house). I probably have what you will end up with by the way your sounding. I run 2 175w mh and 2 65w pc's in my hood an iwaki md-20rxt return pump @ 55 watts I think. 4 20w power heads on a wave master and a 40 watt pump pushing my skimmer and a 350 watt heater. I run the lights a total of 11hrs with the halides running 8.5 of that. I sat down once and figured out exactly what it cost to run my tank(after some whining from the wife) and it came out to just under 16 dollars a month, granted I live in the midwest and about 15 miles from a nuclear power plant so our electricity isn't too bad, and I'm only running one tank now. It really isnt that expensive to run a mh hood

[Chuck S]

Prices will be relative to the area you live in. My estimate is from my area and given I have 5 tanks. Yeah a smaller tank would be less. My bill last month was whole house 195.00. I usually guage things on the fact it was about 85.00 a month electric before tanks. 40-60 is a worse case scenario. 40 in winter and 60 in summer counting a chiller or AC.

[cronicreef]

I can't tell you about the electic bill I still live at home. Hey that's great for me plus I live for free still.
It might be something I will have to look into befor getting MH lights.

For flow rate I'm running 800gph and I think it is to small for my 50 gal. I seen 15 gal tanks run more than I do and they hardly have any algea because of it. I know there is alot more factors than just flow rate but flow is the big thing that my friend played around with. He said it made a huge difference. So I'm going to try it on my nexted tank.



The noise isn't all that bad. My power heads are worse. But in my sumps water line is about 1" from the top of my filter tray.

TopQuark

Pre drill tanks are just easier to set up because the tank is ready to be set up. Flow rate will vary because of overflow/pipeing size. Some people don't even use overflows. Canister in some people opions are better. Many people fight over it and will tell you there way is the best. The same for everything in this hobby. It's Best to do your homework and fine what is best for you.

Thats just my opion

[topQuark]

My Dad's just about done with the stand for the 75 gallon tank, so my wife and I have started ordering additional hardware. We've been using DI water for the 5.5 gallon nano (which is about 6 months old now and seems to be doing great), but the DI filters are pretty expensive, so we just ordered a 4-stage Spetra-pure RO/DI system (40 GPD).

We've also ordered 2x96 Watt actinic PC lighting for the tank, which we intend to supplement some MH lighting. What I'm not sure about yet is if I want to use 2x175 or 2x250 for the MH lighting --so we haven't ordered the MH stuff yet. What do you guys think... 2x175 or 2x250 for a 75 gallon which will have 2x96 actinic PC lighting? I'm pretty sure that I want to go with IceCaps... but I'm just not certain about wattage.

[tendar]

250 all the way for a few dollars more and lots more light.

[topQuark]

Two 250 Watt MH lights? That seems like a lot to me, but we would like to keep SPS and perhaps some clams one day.

How high above the surface of the tank should I position the halides? I wanted to build a canopy for them...

Our tank is an Oceanic Reef-Ready, so it has the glass center brace. We got the glass tops with the tank, but I'm not sure if we should use them. What do you guys think?

[tendar]

Dont use the glass tops.
250's all the way for good color on your sps.I would have them with the bulbs 10" above water line.

[topQuark]

We received our SpectraPure RO/DI system today... UPS smashed the box, and one of the plastic elbow fittings broke. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/frown.gif SpectraPure said that they would mail me a new fitting, but it might not be in for a few days.

We also received our pump... we bought one of the PanWorld pumps. It looks really nice, but it didn't come with any instructions or warranty information. Can someone tell me where to attach the inlet hose and the outlet hose? One hose can be attached axially, and one can be attached transversely. Is the axial the inlet and the transverse the outlet? Also, should I get all of the air out of the tubing before turning this baby on?

[tendar]

On most pump the out going up is the out let and the one on the side sticking staigh out is the inlet.

[topQuark]

So my parent's visited my wife and I over the weekend. My father has finished the cabinet for our 75 gallon aquarium and it looks just great! Honestly, I think that it's the nicest aquarium stand that I have ever seen. It's stained and really looks like a piece of furnature. He did a great job, and I am very thankful that I have such a great (and handy) father. I'll post a photo of the stand just as soon as I can.

The right side of the stand opens up so that one can slide a sump and other hardware in which wouldn't fit through either of the two cabinet doors. There is enough clearance in that cabinet for something 13"W x 48"L x 20"H.

Now I just have to find a sump... Do people usually keep the sump open or covered when it is inside a cabinet? Has anyone kept an open top sump and had any problems/solutions for mold and mildue issues? Should I keep the sump covered?

[topQuark]

Okay, I put the finish on the stand last night (sans doors, which have been removed so that I can varnish them later) and here is a photo of the tank and stand... Just ready for water. We've go the RO/DI unit running 24/7 to filter enough water... this will take awhile... http://www.reeftalk.com/photos/501/1445DCP_1575_sm-med.JPG

[topQuark]

How in the F%#K do I remove photos once I have uploaded them? I accidentally uploaded the same file three times, so now I need to delete at least two of them.

[tendar]

Since the stand is pretty closed up you may want to add a small fan to circulate air in and out of the stand to help control moisture in it.
Usally sumps are open top since it is hard to have and top once your have cords and a skimmer in it.
Looks good.
Ok deleted 2 of them for you.

[topQuark]

Here's the photo again... apparently the one I referenced got deleted.

http://www.reeftalk.com/photos/508/1445DCP_1575_sm-med.JPG

[tendar]

Sorry didnt know which one of referenced.

[topQuark]

Okay, so we've filled up the tank with RO/DI water, and I've got a temporary plumbing setup (just to make sure that I know what I'm doing before I make a real mess inside our nice cabinet. I've got a ball valve on the output of the external pump, and when I open that baby up all the way, the overflow sounds like a friggin waterfall. I mean it's REALLY loud. Has anyone else encountered this problem? Should I put a ball valve on the overflow output line so that some water builds up in the overflow box and then water flowing into the overflow doesn't have to fall some 20 inches before hitting something?

[topQuark]

That Pan World pump I bought from Premium Aquatics is pretty darn loud too. How loud are external pumps usually?

[tendar]

YOu probably need a durso stand pipe which will quite down your overflow alot. DO NOT put a ball valve on your overflow will only lead to flooding.
External pumps very in loudness. Most of the noise is usally from the internal fan that helps keep them cool. I have not tryed one of the Pan world pumps so have no idea how loud they are.

Here is a link to building you own Durso stand pipe. Only costs about $6-7 in plumbing parts and takes about 5 minutes to do works like a charm.
http://www.dursostandpipes.com/

[topQuark]

Thanks for the quick reply tendar. The Durso link seems to be broken this morning. I'll try later today.

The Pan World pump is louder than the gentle water trickling noise coming from the overflow. We can still hold conversations in that room, but the noise from the pump alone is a lot louder than we would like.

[topQuark]

So my wife and I added some of the Southdown sand to our tank last night, in addition to a few pieces of live rock. We did rinse the sand off a couple of times prior to adding it to the tank, however the tank still clowded over and it has not cleared up yet. Is this normal or should we have done a better job at washing the Southdown sand? The grain size for the Southdown seems to be extremely fine, so I seriously doubt that washing it more would make much of a difference.

[tendar]

This is normal. DId you get a protien skimmer yet I cant remember. If so it will help to clean it much faster. The sand will settle as bacteria builds up on it over the next few weeks weight it down so any disturbance in the sand till them will continue to make sand storm. A filter bag will also help to speed up the clearing process should you have one.

[topQuark]

Thanks for the reply Tendar. We haven't started a protein skimmer yet... Still need to order that (Aqua-C EV series skimmer). We don't have a filter bag either... Perhaps I should go pick one up.

Hey, has anyone ever noticed that the bags for Southdown sand say "not recommended for aquarium use"? I hope that this sand will be okay to use!

[tendar]

Yeah they put that on there to protect them selves from any law suits should some one have a problem with thier sand in a tank. Hundreds if not thousands of people have used it with out a problem including me.
The sand storm will clear sooner or later. Could take a week or so though with out a skimmer or filter pad or anything though.

[topQuark]

The sand storm is starting to show signs of abating. I shut off two powerheads which are inside the tank in the hopes that it would help speed up the process... currently just running with the external pump for circulation. Might be ordering the Aqua-C soon...

My wife and I put 200 lbs of Southdown in the tank... as far as I can tell (with the sandstorm and all) we've got a 4" deep sand bed. This seems like a lot of sand if you ask me, but other postings and various other websites seemed to advocate having a sandbed of this depth. We also put some of that plastic light-diffuser grating in the bottom of our tank. What do you guys think? Should we remove some of the sand?

[tendar]

If your going for the deep sand approach then leave what you have and another inch would not hurt as a DSB requires 4-6 depth to be good and effective also the sand will settle some like 1/2".
One suggestion next time you do another tank. Put the sand in first the put a plate or some thing on top of the sand and start off slowly adding water to the tank over the plate which dispurses the water and will not stire up the sand near as bad as dumping sand in a tank full of water. I know NOW YOU TELL ME> LOL

[topQuark]

Well, we had never actually filled the tank before, and I wanted to be certain that it wouldn't leak before I filled it up with the sand. I suppose that I could have filled it up with tap water and that just poured the tap water down the drain, but that seemed like it would be an awful waste of about 100 gallons of tap water.

I do have one more bag of Southdown that hasn't been added yet so I suppose that we could add all or part of that. However, we have two 5.5 gallon nanos which will be merged with the 75 gallon tank when it is stable. Additionally, we intend to buy several pounds of live sand from various locations to get some real bio-diversity in the sand bed. I think that with all of the extra sand that we will be adding in the near future, there will be a sufficient amount to create a sandbed somewhere in the 4-6" range.

I have a question about which pump to use for the Aqua-C EV 180 skimmer that we intend to purchase... Marine Depot offers the following pumps with the EV-180:

Rio 3100 (I've heard bad things about the Rios, e.g. oil leaks)
Mag-Drive 7
Dolphin Dp-800

In sump would be nice... then I don't have to get another hole drilled in our new CPR sump.

[topQuark]

Actually, we already poured a significant amount of waste water down the drain thanks to the RO/DI unit. I suppose that we could have filled the tank up with the waste water but I don't know why on Earth you would want to do that!

I suppose the real answer is that we didn't have anywhere else to put 100 gallons of RO/DI water, other than in the tank itself!

[tendar]

I run the mag7 on my aquaC ev180 and runs great
your are right skip anything with rio on it for powerheads
The dolphin is a good pump but tends to run the hotest of the three pumps.

[topQuark]

Sorry, I just remembered that you posted the same information about using the Mag-7 at the start of this post. It has taken us awhile to get everything purchased and set up!

The Durso standpipe arrived in the mail yesterday... I need to drill the hole in the cap and set it up. Maybe I'll do that tonight.

We ordered the Aqua-C EV-180 skimmer for our tank with the Mag-7. I also payed the extra $5 to get the speed-fit fitting for a calcium reactor installed. We don't have a calcium reactor yet, but it sounds like a good idea, so I figured that we might as well get the fitting installed in the skimmer now rather than regret it later on down the road.

Are many reefers using these calcium reactors? What kind would you recommend getting? We have a 75 gallon tank and would like to keep some stony corals eventually --not too mention we would like to see obscene amounts of coraline algae growth on the live rock.

[NeilsReef]

Hello, where do you get Southdown sand? I live in the Northwest and I am unable to find it at our local Home Depot, Lowes or any other hardware store. I have heard rumors that it was no longer available? Thanks for your help. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/cool.gif neilz_mail@yahoo.com

[tendar]

south down is mainly a east coast thing. Very hard to get it anywhere else. We actually got a home depot to bring in a semi load 16 pallets last year though.

Calcium reactors are being used more and more by people with sps and clam tanks since they suck up calcium so fast. I actually need to get one my self. I can not make a reconedation at the moment since dont have one or used one before.

[topQuark]

I live just outside of Chicago (Midwest) and my local Home Depot has the Southdown sand.

Hey, I'm wondering if anyone has used the Wave2k in their tank (checkout www.wave2k.com (http://www.wave2k.com)). I'm wondering if there are any problems with small animals getting inside of the wave-making box.

[topQuark]

Just an update on our 75 gallon reef... It's been up and running with for about a month now with salt water, 200 lbs of Southdown sand, 10 lbs of live sand, and about 50 lbs of live rock. We intend to buy more live rock real soon... We picked up an Aqua-C EV-180 skimmer with the Mag-7 pump, but I need to get two new holes drilled in the sump before we can start running the skimmer. I'll try to get the holes drilled this weekend if I get a chance. Our sump is a CPR acrylic.

[topQuark]

Another update... We finally got the holes drilled in the CPR sump for the Aqua-C skimmer and the Mag-7. We hooked up the skimmer yesterday afternoon and it's been running just fine. I can't wait for the skimmer to break in and really start foaming!

We added more live rock, and now have about 100-110 lbs in the tank. We got a pair of two spot gobies a week ago, they should help keep the sand bed looking great. Saturday morning we moved our clown fish over to the 75 gallon and permanently took down the nano that they were living in. They seem excited to have a lot more room!

The tank temperature is about 82 and we just can't seem to keep it down much lower than that (even with the AC on in the house). We are using all of our pumps externally, but I'm afraid that the pumps are just heating up the water too much. When we took the sump out to add the skimmer, I drilled some 4.5" diameter holes in the back of the stand and put a small fan from radio shack in front of one hole. I thought that this would help keep the temp. down, but it really hasn't helped much at all. We might need to get a chiller. I've been thinking about getting one of the new Arctica chillers. Has anyone had much experience with these chillers? Good/bad comments on the Arctica chillers?

[tendar]

YOu could try a small 6" clip on fan in the sump first it usally does wonders for temps.

[topQuark]

Thanks for the advice Gregg. Our CPR sump still has a fit lid on it, so maybe I should take that off? I was just concerned about splashing and excessive evaporation, but I do think that the evaporation will exchange the most heat.

We haven't even added the metal halides yet (all we're running at the moment lighing-wise are the power compacts) and we're already seeing temperature problems. I've still got the glass tops half on the tank (to support the kludged hood for the power compact lighting until my father and I can build a nicer one which will match the stand and can hold the MH lights as well).

I'll have to rig up a water top-off system for the 75 gallon tank as well. How much water are you guys loosing per day due to evaporation? I'm curious about people who run 75 gallon tanks with MH lighting and heavy circulation.

[tendar]

On my 58 with a large sump and halides I go through from 1-2 gallons a day.
Removing the covers will help to bring down the temps some.

[topQuark]

We've got a lot of debris floating around in our water... Little white bits of this and that. The skimmer has been running now for about three weeks now.

We don't currently have any filter socks in our system, but I'm really wondering if it will help to take out some of the suspended matter. Any ideas?

[tendar]

I run filter socks now and them to help clean the water of excess stuff floating or when I stire stuff up.

[brody98]

my 75 has a 650 gph return and 4 100 gph heads circulating, the tank is open top with the lights (mh 175's) about 8 inches above the water line and mine looses about 1.5 gal a day

[Deejay]

I use 2x250 on my 75 (with 2 VHO 110's) Seems to be ok, but did notice a LOT more algae growth after putting the lights on. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif

(Opps! My first page stopped where you were talking about lights... Thus this reply. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif )

Deej